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Lineages, Results, and Analysis of Y-DNA Haplogroup R-1b1b-2a1a-1 (U198) ROSEs — Groups K and K1
in the ROSE DNA Project at FamilyTreeDNA
The purpose of this page is to allow members of Groups K and K1 of the ROSE DNA Project — and genealogists researching these families — to more easily share and understand their test results.  Anyone who is a member of this group is encouraged to contact me.  We need to have more complete lineages.  Also, if you have tested more than 37 markers, please share these results.

And the bottom line here is that everyone needs to upgrade to 67 markers if you're going to get any more use out of these results, that is, beyond just supporting that you are connected somewhere back in time; and everyone with a mutation away from the modal needs to test cousins until the exact location of that mutation is determined.
Several members of these groups have been deep SNP tested with the result that their most downstream positive SNP is U198, making them Haplogroup R-1b1b-2a1a-1.  Of the seven standard markers that differ between the R1b modal and the R-U198 modal, three are key, namely, DYS390, YCAIIb, and 607, and our K and K1 groups share these.  K and K1 are, at least so far, the only R-U198 groups in the ROSE project.

Group K and K1 members are encouraged to also join the U198 / S29 Project at FamilyTreeDNA.  You can do so from the "Join Projects" button on your FTDNA member page.
The ROSE project suggests that Group K2 bears a relationship to K and K1.  The Group K2 modal haplotype has only a 28/37 match with the modal haplotype of Group K and only a 27/37 match with the modal for Group K1, which are decided non-matches.  Nor does the Group K2 haplotype have any of the three signature markers for R-U198, so it is not even in the same haplogroup subclade.
GD = Genetic Distance, the number of mutation events separating two haplotypes. In the case of these tables, it's the GD from the testee to the family's modal haplotype.
To view more of the page without scrolling, temporarily reduce the text size or page size in your browser. 
Red labels indicate markers that typically mutate more frequently than those labeled in black.
(Empty cells that are darkened indicate those tests have not been ordered.)
Return to Haplogroup R1b Hub
Group K
To view lineages, please scroll to the right.
GD
(cumulative)		 Earliest Ancestor Kit # Ysearch
UserID		 Haplotype — as determined by STR testing Lineage
Markers 1-12 Markers 13-25 Markers 26-37 Markers 38-67
at
12		 at
25		 at
37		 at
67		 3
9
3		 3
9
0		 19
/
3
9
4		 3
9
1		 a
|
3
8
5		 b
|
3
8
5		 4
2
6		 3
8
8		 4
3
9		 i
|
3
8
9		 3
9
2		 ii
|
3
8
9		 4
5
8		 a
|
4
5
9		 b
|
4
5
9		 4
5
5		 4
5
4		 4
4
7		 4
3
7		 4
4
8		 4
4
9		 a
|
4
6
4		 b
|
4
6
4		 c
|
4
6
4		 d
|
4
6
4		 4
6
0		 H4
|
G
A
T
A		 IIa
|
Y
C
A		 IIb
|
Y
C
A		 4
5
6		 6
0
7		 5
7
6		 5
7
0		 a
|
C
D
Y		 b
|
C
D
Y		 4
4
2		 4
3
8		 5
3
1		 5
7
8		 a
|
S1
3
9
5		 b
|
S1
3
9
5		 5
9
0		 5
3
7		 6
4
1		 4
7
2		 S1
4
0
6		 5
1
1		 4
2
5		 a
|
4
1
3		 b
|
4
1
3		 5
5
7		 5
9
4		 4
3
6		 4
9
0		 5
3
4		 4
5
0		 4
4
4		 4
8
1		 5
2
0		 4
4
6		 6
1
7		 5
6
8		 4
8
7		 5
7
2		 6
4
0		 4
9
2		 5
6
5
R1b (M343) Modal Values 55GU9 13 24 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 19 29 15 15 17 17 11 11 19 23 16 15 18 17 36 38 12 12 11 9 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23 23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 22 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 12 12 Modals per Charles Kerchner, admin of R1b Project (n=1000+).
R-1b1b-2a1a-1 (U198) Modal Values 7PEEZ 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 19 29 15 15 17 18 11 11 19 22 16 14 16 17 38 38 12 12 11 9 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23 23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 22 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 13 12 Modals per DGM extracted from U198 Project (31 Aug 2009).
                 
Group K Modal Values S8WP7 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             (n=31 at 25 markers; n=15 at 37 markers)
0 0 0   William ROSE - 1 6942 MDK2A 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … … Nathan2 William1 ROSE (1747- ) of Orange and Onondaga Cos., NY [wife Mary De WITT]
0 0 0   Alexander SMITH 106216   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … Alexander1 SMITH (1839- ) of PA and New Orleans, LA — NPE
0 0 1   Henry ROSE 70798   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 17 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... Charles3 Henry Matthias2 Henry1 ROSE (1804- ) of NY [wife Candes/Candice]
0 0 1   Israel ROSE 5874   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 41 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … … Ruben Roluff3 Ruben2 Israel1 ROSE (c1730-1790) of Orange Co., NY [wife Phoebe]
0 0 2   John ROSE - 1 6982   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 17 17 38 39 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … … Abraham4 William3 Abraham2 John1 ROSE (c1700-1755 ) of Salem, NJ [wife-1 Mary]
0 0     John ROSE - 1 24916   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … … Ezekiel2 John1 ROSE (c1700-1755 ) of Salem, NJ [wife-2 Elizabeth]
1 1     Ezekiel ROSE 10701   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 13 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … George4 Ezekiel3 Ezekiel2 Ezekiel1 ROSE (c1710-1768) of Hunterdon, NJ [wife Mary FIDLER]
(said to be possible brother of the above John)
1 2 3   Ezekiel ROSE 22375   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 13 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 15 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 17 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … Martin5 Jonathan4 John3
0 0     Ezekiel ROSE 5922   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … Richard4 Ezekiel3 Jonathan2
2 2 4   Ezekiel ROSE 10264   13 23 15 11 11 13 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 12 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 37 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … … John3 Charles2
0 0     John ROSE - 2 6609   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … … John1 ROSE (1764-1825) of Greene Co., PA [wife Hannah ADDLEMAN]
0 0     Samuel ROSE 12724   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … … … … Samuel1 ROSE (c1700- ) of Tuckerton, Ocean Co., NJ [wife Anna DUCKWORTH]
0 0     Emanuel ROSE 110803   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … Dr. Freeman "Dock"3 Enoch B.2   Emanuel1 ROSE (c1794- ) of Cherokee Co., NC, and Fannin Co., GA [wife Margaret HISE]
0 0     Benjamin ROSE 111900   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... Frank H.3 Israel Monroe2 Benjamin F.1 ROSE (1806/7->1870) of Long Island, NY, OH, and WI [wife Margaret WESTBROOK]
0 0     Robert ROSE - 1 92279   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … James3 John2 Robert1 ROSE (c1770- ) of Washington Co., PA, and Montgomery Co., KY [wife Jane CREE]
0 0 1   Robert ROSE - 1 35787   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 37 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... Harvey B.5 Harvey B.4 William3 Josiah2
0 0     Robert ROSE - 2 34901   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … Alvah Buckingham4 Ezekiel3 Ezekiel2 Robert1 ROSE (c1731- ) of VA? PA? NJ? NY?
[wife Johanna CRAWFORD]
0 0 1   Robert ROSE - 2 5659   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 10 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … …  … Jeremiah3 Tychicus2
0 1     Robert ROSE - 2 34038   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 19 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … …
0 0     David ROSE 3855   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … … … David1 ROSE (c1724-1781) of L.I., NY, Lancaster Co., PA, and Washington Co MD
descendants to Trumbull and Mahoning Cos., OH [wife Hannah PARR]
1 1 1   David ROSE 14809   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 11 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … Levi B.4 Jesse3 James2
0 0     Matthias ROSE 10089   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … Matthias4 Robert3 Matthias2 Matthias1 ROSE (1727- ) of Albany and Saratoga Cos., NY, and Ontario, Canada
0 0 1   Matthias ROSE 62503   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 39 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … George W.4 Samuel3
0 2 4   Matthias ROSE 14018   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17 10 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 15 15 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 39 39 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … Benjamin4 Daniel3
1 3 6   Abraham ROSE 7298   13 23 14 11 12 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17 10 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 15 15 11 11 19 22 15 14 17 17 40 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … Theodore F.5 Samuel4 William S.3 William2 Abraham1 ROSE (1729- ) of Cumberland Co., NJ [wife Phoebe HILDRETH]
0 0 2   Abraham ROSE 67340   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 15 14 17 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … … George W.4
0 0     Abraham ROSE 40366   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … William P.4
0 2 2   Stagton ROSE 10799   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 16 17 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             Pvt... … Charles Albert2 Stagton1 ROSE (c1802- ) of NJ and Somerset Co., PA [wife Sophia SMITH]
0 1     Abr. Lacy ROSE 14826   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 30 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … … Abraham Lacy1 ROSE (1794-1869) of Seneca Falls, NY, and Marion Co., IA [wife Sarah ROSE, she of Group Y]
1 3     Daniel ROSE 60038   13 23 15 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 16  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 30 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … … Napoleon Bonaparte2 Daniel Darius1 ROSE (c1792- ) of York Co., ME, and Randolph Co., AR [wife Lucinda Jane]
2 5     William ROSE - 2 7249   13 23 14 10 11 13 12 12 12 14 13 30 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 28 15 15 16 17                                                                                     Pvt... … William3 George Washington2 William1 ROSE (c1790- ) of Otsego Co., NY [wife Ruth COMSTOCK]
                 
Calculating genetic distance (GD):
  • Any mutation in DYS389i is reflected in DYS389ii, so the change from 29 to 30 at DYS389ii (grey table cells) does not represent a second mutation event.
  • The mutation to 15,15 at DYS464c,d (bright green table cells) is counted as one mutation event, not two, because DYS464 is prone to "recLOH" (recombinant loss of heterozygosity) events.  That is, what appears to have happened here is that the a,b alleles have overwritten the c,d alleles in a single mutation event.  As such events are relatively common for this marker, it cannot necessarily be assumed that possessing it is a sign of close relationship.  The location of the event in the testee's line must be pinpointed by testing cousins to be certain we aren't looking at two independent events, although the shared mutation at DYS459a suggests it was one.
Data Sources:
"Rose Family DNA Project Results — to April 8, 2009." Rose Family Bulletin (June 2009).
Ysearch.; SMGF; ROSE Family DNA Project; ROSE-DNA Mailing List; email.
   
Group K1
To view lineages, please scroll to the right.
GD
(cumulative)		 Earliest
Ancestor		 Kit # Ysearch
UserID		 Haplotype — as determined by STR testing Lineage
Markers 1-12 Markers 13-25 Markers 26-37 Markers 38-67 Advanced Markers
at
12		 at
25		 at
37		 at
67		 3
9
3		 3
9
0		 19
/
3
9
4		 3
9
1		 a
|
3
8
5		 b
|
3
8
5		 4
2
6		 3
8
8		 4
3
9		 i
|
3
8
9		 3
9
2		 ii
|
3
8
9		 4
5
8		 a
|
4
5
9		 b
|
4
5
9		 4
5
5		 4
5
4		 4
4
7		 4
3
7		 4
4
8		 4
4
9		 a
|
4
6
4		 b
|
4
6
4		 c
|
4
6
4		 d
|
4
6
4		 4
6
0		 H4
|
G
A
T
A		 IIa
|
Y
C
A		 IIb
|
Y
C
A		 4
5
6		 6
0
7		 5
7
6		 5
7
0		 a
|
C
D
Y		 b
|
C
D
Y		 4
4
2		 4
3
8		 5
3
1		 5
7
8		 a
|
S1
3
9
5		 b
|
S1
3
9
5		 5
9
0		 5
3
7		 6
4
1		 4
7
2		 S1
4
0
6		 5
1
1		 4
2
5		 a
|
4
1
3		 b
|
4
1
3		 5
5
7		 5
9
4		 4
3
6		 4
9
0		 5
3
4		 4
5
0		 4
4
4		 4
8
1		 5
2
0		 4
4
6		 6
1
7		 5
6
8		 4
8
7		 5
7
2		 6
4
0		 4
9
2		 5
6
5		 4
6
1		 4
6
2		 A10
|
G
A
T
A		 C4
|
6
3
5		 GA
AT
1
B
0
7		 4
4
1		 4
4
5		 4
5
2		 4
6
3
R1b Modal Values C7BED 13 24 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 19 29 15 15 17 17 11 11 19 23 16 15 18 17 36 38 12 12 11  9 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23 23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 22 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 12 12 12 11 13 23 10 13 12 30 22 Modals per David Wilson (to make comparable to FTDNA/SMGF, had to add 19 to DYS 452).
R-U198 Modal Values 7PEEZ 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 19 29 15 15 17 18 11 11 19 22 16 14 16 17 38 38 12 12 11  9 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23 23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 22 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 13 12 12 11 12 25 10 13 12 30 22 Standard marker modals per DGM extracted from U198 Project (31 Aug 2009); advanced marker modals per John Sloan.
                   
Group K1 Modal Values KUYQ8 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                             12 11 12 25 10 13 12 30 23 (for ROSE only: n=14 at 12 markers; n=13 at 25 markers; n=8 at 37 markers; advanced markers n=1)
1 1     John ROSE 1761 20034   13 23 14 11 10 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … … James Robert3 Robert William2 John David1 ROSE (1771-1843) 
of Harrison Co., (W)VA, and Wolfe Co., KY
[wife Rebecca BOWEN]
0 0 0   John ROSE 1761 6854   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                                               Pvt... … … Allison4
1       John ROSE 1761 118631   12 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31                                                                                                                                 Pvt...  … Samuel Lee5 James Buchanan4
0 0     John ROSE 17611 4346   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16           12 12                                                             12 11 12 25 10 13 12 30 23 Pvt... … Charles Lee5 Leander Crawford4 Robert William3
0 0     John ROSE 1761 11535   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … … Ezekiel M3
0 0 0   John ROSE 1761 68357   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12                                                                               Pvt... … … … James Nelson3 David Bowen2
0 0     John ROSE 1761 78532   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … Jefferson Morrison4 John David3 John Jackson2
0 0 1   John ROSE 1761 51494   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 37 40 12 12                                                                               Pvt... … … Joseph Powell4 Robert Jefferson3
0 1 2   John ROSE 1761 3798   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 14 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 37 40 12 12                                                                               Pvt... … … Elijah Chambers4 Elijah Chambers3
0 0 1   John ROSE 1761 62940   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 19 17 38 40 12 12                                                                               Pvt...  … Walter5  William4 Samuel3 Israel George2
0 0     John ROSE 1761 109011   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … William Henry4 William Henry3
1 1 2   John ROSE 1761 127193   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 32 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 39 12 12                                                                               Pvt... Ira6 Arkillas5 Logan4 Anderson N3  Samuel2
1 2 3   John ROSE 1761 76537   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 32 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 16 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 39 12 12                                                                               Pvt... … … Robert Lee4
0 0     John ROSE 1761 109656   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt...  … … … David P3 Powell2
0 1 1 ? Alexander BROWN 49243 hjpv6 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 14 15 16 17 11 11 19 22 16 14 18 17 38 40 12 12 11 10 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23 23 16 12 12 12 15 8 12 22 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 13 12                   Pvt... …  … … … William4 William3 Alexander2 (c1740s-1796)
of PA [wife Mary TYLER]		 James1 BROWN
0 1     Alexander BROWN 59934   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 14 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … … Lewis C.5
0 1     Alexander BROWN 105360   13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 31 17  9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 14 15 16 17                                                                                                       Pvt... … … … … … James3
1Also tested at SMGF.
John ROSE is not more distant genetically than any of the other progenitors in Group K, he simply has the most descendants of any single progenitor in Group K, which makes his value of 31 at DYS389ii seem more significant than it really is.  From a genetic standpoint, one could just as logically spin off every progenitor in Group K into his own group (e.g., K2, K3, etc.).  If and when John is connected on paper to someone in Group K, either they are going to have to be moved into K1 or John will need to go back into Group K, that is, if you want the groups to represent real clades, which is desirable.
Having this many descendant from one progenitor tested, it's possible to begin building a "node chart" or cladogram for them.  The more markers everyone tests, the more accurate and more detailed the cladogram can be, and such a cladogram is powerful support for a paper pedigree.
The BROWNs were placed in Group K1 (as opposed to Group K) apparently because they are 31 at DYS389ii, and the ROSE DNA project therefore asserts they descend through John ROSE of Wolfe Co., KY:
"Wm. Brown (m. Sarah Lewis) c 1771 and James Brown (name of their ROSE ancestor through John Rose is unknown)"
The problem is that William BROWN (b. ca. 1771) was too old to be a son of this John ROSE (b. 1761).  Also, the descendants of both William and James BROWN (b. 1780 or 1791 — sources disagree) have a value at DYS464a of 14.  Because they share this value, their father (at least) had to have had that value, but John does not and no one else in Group K or K1 does.  If these BROWNs are related to these ROSEs, the connection is further back and definitely not through John.  We need at least one of the Group K1 ROSEs to upgrade to 67 markers — or to share those results if they already have.
These BROWNs are also in Group 64 of the BROWN Project., and while their earliest ancestors in the ROSE project are William and James, their earliest ancestor at Ysearch is given as Alexander BROWN.  (The two BROWNs tested to 25 markers have been uploaded to Ysearch as W299Y and 9VKQP, but I can't tell which is which.)  The contact for all three of these BROWNs is the same person, and — if you are reading this page — I would ask that you please contact me to be certain I have the correct earliest ancestor and can associate the correct Ysearch UserIDs and FTNDA kit numbers.
Data Sources:
"Rose Family DNA Project Results — to April 8, 2009." Rose Family Bulletin (June 2009).
Ysearch.; SMGF; ROSE Family DNA Project; ROSE-DNA Mailing List; email.
     
What constitutes a match?
Matches in other surnames are usually mere coincidence, so please ignore them — I'll let you know when you shouldn't!
For 12 markers:  9 or less is a non-relative; 10-12, please see this Chart compiled by FTDNA.
For 25 markers:  21 or less is a non-relative; 22-25, please see this Chart compiled by FTDNA.
For 37 markers:  31 or less is a non-relative; 32-37, please see this Chart compiled by FTDNA.
For 67 markers:  55 or less is a non-relative; 56-67, please see this Chart compiled by FTDNA.
For any test:  0 matching markers, please contact NASA.
 
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